Official Kratos Discussion Thread (SPOILERS AHEAD!!!)

chikori · Last edited by chikori on Sun Aug 08, 2004 1:41 am; edited 1 time in total

[Akuedit: Yes, this thread has *large number here* pages. However, that does not call for a sticky, and therefore, please do not ask for one/ask if it is possible to gain one. One reason is because no other character threads got sticked. Two--Just because a thread has many posts does not merit a sticky. Finally, three: This thread doesn't need a sticky to keep it from falling back. '-']

Well, don't read this if you don't want to get spoiled...

I was thinking about this when I was at work. (Yeah, at work.) Is Kratos REALLY a traitor? I know I'm going to get hurt for thinking outloud like this, however, I really don't think you could consider that man as a traitor... If you view it at a different perspective. He never vow or swore that he'll never betray them, he was "hired" to make sure the Chosen will reach the Tower of Salvation, he just never explained himself. So in some way, he really didn't betray them... On top of that, he was sent as a "spy", to make sure things are going according to their plan. So if he actually sided with Lloyd, then he's a "real" traitor, to the Cruxis.

I think a lot of us hate him because he "betrayed" Lloyd's party, and our main hero is Lloyd, but if we look at it differently... What if Lloyd is sent to become a spy in the Cruxis organisation? Then he got all the information he needs, yada yada and return back to Colette, then he's a true hero... (However, he would "betray" the Cruxis.) But I'm sure most of us would think that's okay. Now, if he end up siding with the Cruxis, then we'll call him a traitor... So... Reverse all those roles and look at Kratos... I would not deny that fact that he hurt and betrayed Lloyd's (and everyone else's) TRUST, however, I wouldn't call him a traitor since he did what he was supposed to do... As one of the Seraphim...

Umm... Please don't flame me that much. I don't like pain. XD That was just my cent and a half.

Fire_Thanatos

Aku · Joined: 05 Jul 2004 Posts: 9480

I agree with you. Many people dislike Kratos simply because he backstabs you at the Tower of Salvation, which I find is quite a mundane reason. At the scene at Altessa's house where Yuan reveals the truth about Kratos (saying he is Lloyd's dad, you can even hear him saying that once Kratos got a family, he lost the ability to fight back. Or something like that.

And, yes, Lloyd never really bought Kratos' loyalty. He just bought his skills. That's what a mercenary is for, right?

I completely concur on the idea that many people don't like him just because, only because he betrays you for the bad side. And you know what? It adds a whole new layer to Kratos, making him a better character. I find it sort of stupid to dislike a character just because he/she is evil/on the bad side. OK...*puts up anti-flaming shield*
_________________
Resigned October 29, 2007. Life calls.

SmashChu · Joined: 10 Jul 2004 Posts: 47

your reasoning is right and all but he was working for you. Lloyd wanted the dasians to be eliminated(as well as the rest of them) and he was with them all the time also he also helped in the spliting world thing and he only wanted Martal vesal so he's not a good guy.

Also the same Idea works for Zelos. The reasons aree different though
_________________
[URL=http://www.smbhq.com/nc/nctest.html]

Which Neglected Mario Character Are You?

Morwen Laicoriel · Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:37 am Post subject:

Hmm...yeah. Yeah, I agree, he never exactly said he was on their side. He was just protecting Colette.

On the OTHER hand, he nearly became like a teacher to Lloyd (almost becoming a father figure while Lloyd was away from Dirk, in fact), and so he did greatly betray their trust, because he was their friend. And he basically tried to kill Colette and the others just by being on that side. So in that sense he DID betray them...

Also, he betrayed his own, original ideals of a world where discrimination would stop, where peace would reign over the land. Yggdrasil said he was working for that, but in the end Yggdrasil's method turned out to do the exact opposite of what he had said they'd do (the Desians discriminated against Humans, as he himself did, and he caused more death because of the Human Ranches than I bet some generals during the war did!). Even after Kratos knew about that, though, he went back to Cruxis. Yes, he was pretty much forced, but at the same time he just went along with it because he just didn't care.

That's no reason to hate Kratos, though. Rolling Eyes

In the end, he admitted that what he had been doing was wrong, and he helped you alot while he was still working for Cruxis. So in the end, I would say that there's no reason to hate Kratos, any more than there's reason to hate Boromir from Lord of the Rings.
_________________

Sig by Cruxis
l33t beat -- My blog covering anime, video games, animation, and fantasy fiction.
Wii Friend Code: 6637 2117 5258 2978

Mani · Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:45 am Post subject:

Aku · Joined: 05 Jul 2004 Posts: 9480

chikori · Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:52 am Post subject:

Morwen Laicoriel · Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 1:12 am Post subject:

Well, Yuan said it himself "You changed...you lost the will to fight". Maybe he thought that in the end, it was his fighting back against Cruxis that caused what happened with Anna and Lloyd to happen. Maybe he was afraid of actually hurting Lloyd, and felt that the best way to protect him would be from the inside...

Truthfully, I think that Kratos is a bit emotionally unstable. He never went quite as crazy as Yggdrasil, but it almost seems that he became rather suicidal. (He says it constantly: "Life had no more meaning" "I've failed to die once more"...that sounds like someone considering suicide. It sounds like Yggdrasil might've stopped him from killing himself at one point , since Yggdrasil needed him to live since Kratos was the Origin Seal.) Also, Kratos seems to feel very helpless--one of the things he seems fond of is the idea of fate ("Blame your fate!" "You cannot oppose fate"). I think he feels like what happened to him was fated to happen, and he's tired of fighting against what he feels is his fate.

Man...that was a bunch of rambling...^^;
_________________

Sig by Cruxis
l33t beat -- My blog covering anime, video games, animation, and fantasy fiction.
Wii Friend Code: 6637 2117 5258 2978

Mani · Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 1:50 am Post subject:

chikori · Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 1:56 am Post subject:

Morwen Laicoriel · Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 2:14 am Post subject:

That's it!! I haven't even thought about that. He wants to be NORMAL. Have a normal family and just be normal. Gah, I don't know why I didn't think about that before!
_________________

Sig by Cruxis
l33t beat -- My blog covering anime, video games, animation, and fantasy fiction.
Wii Friend Code: 6637 2117 5258 2978

Abicion · Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 4:22 am Post subject:

Going by the Z-Skit where he flat-out lies to Raine about his motives (I forgot the exact wording, but I know it's a little after you land in Palmacosta), I still stand on the opinion that he is a lying, stinking traitor and most die a slow, horrible death.

That is all. Smile

EDIT: Here we go. It's #176 in the Katz skit theater

R: Kratos
K: What is it?
R: Why did you take on the job of guarding Colette?
K: Humph ... I'm a mercenary. That's how we make a living.
R: In other words, it's just a job?
K: That's correct.
R: That's really all?
K: Yes...
_________________

Aku · Joined: 05 Jul 2004 Posts: 9480

Aha! I found Mani's post...

chikori · Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 2:27 pm Post subject: