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Lunar Eclipse
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Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 21363
Location: U.S.A.
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 Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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| TALKING MEAT wrote: | | Is it flaming to repeatedly call someone a troll and/or a flamer when they're doing neither? I can honestly say I don't, but certain people here seem to confuse common sense and logic with flaming unless you take care to sugar-coat everything you're saying with emotes and silly reassurances of how it's nothing personal and you love them really. |
That's actually a good question. Obviously, I've never punished anyone for using logic, but then again, I don't think I've ever punished anyone for calling someone a flamer either ... <_<; In a sense, I suppose calling someone a flamer is a flame as it's a personal insult, but I guess I never saw it as severe since it usually spills from the mouth of someone who's obviously incorrect, and everyone in the topic knows it. ^.^;
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Mr Blobby
Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 18060
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| Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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I guess... it's harmless, and kind of amusing, but when they just go around calling you that everywhere they go even when you're not there to defend yourself or laugh at them, it's kind of annoying. See the first post. =\
| Quote: | From what I understand about arguments, flaming is what happens when a person insults the other person's characteristics instead of pointing out the flaws of the argument.
However, that doesn't mean that saying a person's arguments is stupid/senseless etc. isn't going to make people go on the defensive. |
Yep. Apparently, rebutting their insults and childish tantrums with calm and common sense causes them to fly into a homicidal rage and decide they're far better than you because they don't suffer from the dire sin of being a rational person. |
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Lunar Eclipse
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Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 21363
Location: U.S.A.
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| Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:57 pm Post subject: |
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| TALKING MEAT wrote: | | I guess... it's harmless, and kind of amusing, but when they just go around calling you that everywhere they go even when you're not there to defend yourself or laugh at them, it's kind of annoying. See the first post. =\ |
And I understand ... Hopefully, now that it's been brought to my attention, I'll actually notice it. <_<;
| Mishi wrote: | | I'm sorry about the mod thing, you're right Lunar, and about the other thing we'll have to agree to disagree because it's exceedingly hard for me not to get angry about things, however I still don't think it's flaming to pick apart someone's argument, I'm not insulting them as a person. And IRL I curse like a sailor, so using profanity is just sort of natural to me. |
It's not a problem if you pick apart someone's argument. I've done that before too, most of all in this section of the boards. But, at the same time, I think it's important to be careful with your language because, whenever you use hostile language, you yourself are immediately seen as being hostile. The person whose opinion is being refuted immediately goes on the defensive, responding with similarly hostile language. I just think it's a bad idea to even go there, not because I'll necessarily punish you for it (since you're allowed to use bad words as long as you let the forums censor for you), but you have to understand that if a bigger problem does arise, from my standpoint, it's more difficult to discern exactly where the flaming begins and ends if there's all sorts of hostile language flying around.
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Jaded One
Joined: 29 Mar 2007
Posts: 772
Location: Being busy with Mana Khemia.
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| Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Yep. Apparently, rebutting their insults and childish tantrums with calm and common sense causes them to fly into a homicidal rage and decide they're far better than you because they don't suffer from the dire sin of being a rational person. |
Thing is, you could probably say anything at all about them and it'd just end up the same way.
I took a look at the thread just now to see what was the issue about. I'd admit that it's sort of hard to ignore that kind of thing.
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CovertSushi
Joined: 01 Jul 2004
Posts: 11188
Location: Confirmed. Sending supplies.
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| Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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Honestly, I think that the moderators need to check in on some of the people. Obviously, as we can see from his posts in the "'the' is banned" topic, legrettas_man is quite the basket case and needs to be kept in check. I'll agree that most of what goes on in Forum Games is just harmless fun, but flaming like that is not. I'm honestly quite offended by what was brought to my attention by Courtney and Mishi.
Thank you, Lunar, for actually doing something about that thread. ShikonSoulreaper noted himself that he'd gartered 1700+ posts in a month's time, and undoubtedly that thread helped him achieve such a massive number. That's not a good thing in my opinion.
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Jaded One
Joined: 29 Mar 2007
Posts: 772
Location: Being busy with Mana Khemia.
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| Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 5:48 am Post subject: |
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After seeing what went on in the thread myself, I must say that I'm quite disgusted to see such activities being carried out in secret because they know that moderators can't check all of the threads.
I agree that recent trouble makers should be put underneath the radar, but problems arise again if said poster posts a lot.
I'd also like to thank Lunar for closing the thread. Even by Forum Games standards, that thread was a complete waste of time.
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Captain Planet
Joined: 15 Jan 2008
Posts: 1060
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| Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 11:57 am Post subject: |
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I just read through this entire thread then thought "Man I guess I'd better see what all the fuss is about" and clicked on the links and jeusu christ.
I'm not even sure what the actual 'flaming' was suposed to be.
Dry your eyes love, you deserve what you get for posting in forum games. |
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Mr Blobby
Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 18060
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| Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Planet wrote: |
Dry your eyes love, you deserve what you get for posting in forum games. |
But none of us were posting there.
Anyway, the flaming would be "Admiral jimbob is such an asshole I want to beat him up" (threat of physical harm - instaban?), "everyone in GD is cruel and mean and evil we are so much better than them", "I like to go over to GD and say silly things so they flame me, it's so much fun I'm so mature", etc etc. |
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EEVILMURRAY
Joined: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 12266
Location: England.
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| Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Jaded One wrote: | | I must say that I'm quite disgusted to see such activities being carried out in secret because they know that moderators can't check all of the threads. |
Just because a moderator hasn't come across it, doesn't mean it's been done in secret.
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Jaded One
Joined: 29 Mar 2007
Posts: 772
Location: Being busy with Mana Khemia.
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| Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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I should have elaborated. The thread was something that was not likely to be noticed by mods given its area and nature.
Edit: And upon hindsight, most members.
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Capt. Velocity
Joined: 07 May 2005
Posts: 12734
Location: What time is it?!
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| Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2008 6:34 am Post subject: |
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I don't think it's flaming to say that you disagree, but the thing is...everything isn't a debate, and it's annoying when it gets to the point that everything you post is getting criticized and debated. In the example you posted, Mishi, I would say that you aren't flaming. Making light of a school shooting would be an example of something intolerable. It's very hard not to respond to that kind of thing. Not necessarily for everyone, but there are plenty of people who would have a difficult time not responding.
As for the posts in forums games, they're partially right you know. I'm not saying that they're all innocent, but neither are the regulars in general discussion and such...me included.
| TALKING MEAT wrote: | | Is it flaming to repeatedly call someone a troll and/or a flamer when they're doing neither? I can honestly say I don't, but certain people here seem to confuse common sense and logic with flaming unless you take care to sugar-coat everything you're saying with emotes and silly reassurances of how it's nothing personal and you love them really. |
No offense, but that's not a completely accurate account. It's not merely a matter of logic and common sense. Not in every instance.
| TALKING MEAT wrote: | | Yep. Apparently, rebutting their insults and childish tantrums with calm and common sense causes them to fly into a homicidal rage and decide they're far better than you because they don't suffer from the dire sin of being a rational person. |
That kind of biased and not totally accurate statement too. Sometimes I suppose it's true, but not all the time. You're only look at it one way for what looks like convenience to me.
We're never going to get anywhere with this subject if we can't all admit that all of us have cases where we're at fault.
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DyingMoon
Joined: 18 Oct 2007
Posts: 4823
Location: Getting high with dinosaurs. ^o^
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| Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2008 9:43 am Post subject: |
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| Lunar Eclipse wrote: |
I fixed it a moment ago. I've never pretended to visit Forum Games much at all, so next time, perhaps you all could just PM me? To complain about me not punishing them in the same way is just silly when you know I haven't seen it. If you want to complain about the fact that I don't go into Forum Games, that's a different story, but it's not that I'm trying to treat you unfairly. |
On the subject of that thread, Flarewolf and I had started to think it got out of control when we actually learned the whole situation...As you can see from Mishi's first link to the thread, some of us actually felt bad while others started ranting on. It's as if some members solely went to that thread to complain and start fights...it was ridiculous.
As for my part...I've apologized for what I may have said that hurt someone. I never would mean to hurt anyone, unless I truly thought they deserved it. Call me a kiss ass, but that's how I genuinely feel. A lot of the members would complain and, of course, only tell their side of the story, leaving out the parts about them being the people who actually started the argument. I'm not saying this excuses the fact that I assumed they were telling the truth, though.
Anyways...I will make sure to not be so timid in the future as to report what I think may possibly be flaming in the future, because it's simply unacceptable.
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EEVILMURRAY
Joined: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 12266
Location: England.
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| Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2008 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Jaded One wrote: | I should have elaborated. The thread was something that was not likely to be noticed by mods given its area and nature.
Edit: And upon hindsight, most members. |
"It's always the quiet ones."
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Mr Blobby
Joined: 08 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2008 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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| General Discussion wrote: |
As for the posts in forums games, they're partially right you know. I'm not saying that they're all innocent, but neither are the regulars in general discussion and such...me included. |
If they're partially right, they should say it in the open, in GD or in PMs to the members they're talking about, instead of stirring up **** in the dark corners of the internet away from anyone who might be there to counter their arguments with the actual truth.
| Quote: |
| TALKING MEAT wrote: | | Is it flaming to repeatedly call someone a troll and/or a flamer when they're doing neither? I can honestly say I don't, but certain people here seem to confuse common sense and logic with flaming unless you take care to sugar-coat everything you're saying with emotes and silly reassurances of how it's nothing personal and you love them really. |
No offense, but that's not a completely accurate account. It's not merely a matter of logic and common sense. Not in every instance. |
Yes it is. See? I can make completely unbacked-up statements too.
| Quote: |
| TALKING MEAT wrote: | | Yep. Apparently, rebutting their insults and childish tantrums with calm and common sense causes them to fly into a homicidal rage and decide they're far better than you because they don't suffer from the dire sin of being a rational person. |
That kind of biased and not totally accurate statement too. Sometimes I suppose it's true, but not all the time. You're only look at it one way for what looks like convenience to me.
We're never going to get anywhere with this subject if we can't all admit that all of us have cases where we're at fault. |
It's been true with the majority of people in that particular thread, though I was thinking of one or two people in particular. That said, I have yet to debate with more than two or three people on this forum who do not devolve into name-calling and petty tantrums when I refuse to rise to their ad hominem attacks. I suppose you're excluded, since you just start talking about shiny pineapples or how amusing you apparently find the other person's post, but that's just... baffling. |
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Capt. Velocity
Joined: 07 May 2005
Posts: 12734
Location: What time is it?!
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:43 pm Post subject: |
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| TALKING MEAT wrote: | | If they're partially right, they should say it in the open, in GD or in PMs to the members they're talking about, instead of stirring up **** in the dark corners of the internet away from anyone who might be there to counter their arguments with the actual truth. |
Some people would still claim that it's not true in the slightest and that it's been them that were the horrible people all along either way. I don't know it posting it there is really the coolest thing ever, but it could have been worse.
| TALKING MEAT wrote: | | Yes it is. See? I can make completely unbacked-up statements too. |
What does that mean? I can't go gather every post that proves it goes both ways. Sometimes they are being annoying and childish, but other times they get insulted for no real reason. Just looking around long enough would show it.
| TALKING MEAT wrote: | | It's been true with the majority of people in that particular thread, though I was thinking of one or two people in particular. That said, I have yet to debate with more than two or three people on this forum who do not devolve into name-calling and petty tantrums when I refuse to rise to their ad hominem attacks. I suppose you're excluded, since you just start talking about shiny pineapples or how amusing you apparently find the other person's post, but that's just... baffling. |
If a person feels insulted, they tend to get upset. It's especially the case with people who have difficulty controlling their emotions. And the pineapple thing was only a few times, while finding the post amusing happens some of the time.
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| Ryke wrote: | | Dur-hurrr, i baleivs n sciense is nearly as bad as the religious alternative. |
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